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Re: Is this for real?
- To: or-talk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Subject: Re: Is this for real?
- From: "Stian Øvrevåge" <sovrevage@xxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2007 14:39:51 +0200
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On 4/1/07, xiando <xiando@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> I just opened Tork and there in the server list was a server named
> NSAFortMeade. Is this for real, or is the NSA running a Tor Server?
> If it's for real, it's going to spook a lot of people away from Tor,
> at least those who are inclined to use Tor for political reasons.
In bullet summary, we know:
1. Tor comes from the US Naval Research Laboratory, which is a DoD Corporation
2. NSA is also a DoD Corporation. This is very important to remember, "it's
the NSA!!!"? NO. NSA is a part of Depertment of Defense.
3. Mr. Dingledine, Mr. Mathewson and Mr. Syverson make no secret that DoD use
4. HOW do the DoD get THEIR network security? From MY Tor-servers.
5. HOW do I get MY network security? From DoD using Tor!
See? I pop out of the Tor-network. It could be me. It could be the NSA, or any
other branch of US DoD.
So, should DoD-subsidiaries like NSA run fast Tor-servers? YES! And that is
exactly how YOU get increased security!
You really should realize that DIVERSITY is how I get the security properties
Let me put it like this:
Let's say ONLY people "who are inclined to use Tor for political reasons" were
running Tor-servers. "He's using Tor!! He has political reasons for using it!
GET HIM!"? -OR- "He's using Tor! He COULD be a political activist. Or he
COULD be the NSA. Or he COULD use it simply because he don't want websites
tracking what products he's looked at in the past. Or he COULD .. etc".
If the entire Tor-network was run by US DoD then Yes, that really would be
bad. But if US DoD runs 5% of it? GREAT. We really NEED FAST SERVERS! My view
is that US DoD, and their subsidiaries such as NSA, really SHOULD run
servers. So should China. And Russia. And Venezuela. That is how we get
In bullet summary, here's what I have to say about not only DoD/NSA, but ANY
single entity running a Tor-network, regardless of what you think of them:
You're running 1-5% of the servers? GREAT! THANKS!
You're running MORE than 5% of the servers? WHAT ARE YOU UP TO?
Helping the Tor-network is great. Regardless of you think those doing it are
bad, because it gives diversity and better network security. Only start
paying attention if one single entity are suddently running a large
percentage of the network - DoD/NSA running 50% of the Tor-servers? That
would raise my eyebrows....
That's a great assesment xiando. Say that this actually IS NSA (for
which there is no proof afaik), why automatically assume it's because
they are hunting down thought criminals?
The NSA Mission Statement is posted at http://www.nsa.gov/about/about00003.cfm :
"The ability to understand the secret communications of our foreign
adversaries while protecting our own communications -- a capability in
which the United States leads the world -- gives our nation a unique
This might as well be an effort of the latter as an effort of the
first. But ofcourse, we'll never know for sure...