Re: [tor-talk] Tor and solidarity against online harassment

[Mirimir <mirimir@xxxxxxxxxx>]

On 12/16/2014 02:43 AM, Andreas Krey wrote:
> On Mon, 15 Dec 2014 23:19:38 +0000, Mirimir wrote:
> ...
>> Certainly, Tor helps the US and its allies to consolidate their power.
>> Why else would they fund it?
> 
> Because science?

Yes, that too.

But I don't want my argument to depend on the good intentions of the US
government, because we have no way to demonstrate them to critics. Tor,
unless it is backdoored or intentionally vulnerable, benefits millions
of people in numerous ways. Even if we assume the worst about the US
government and its reasons for funding Tor, the code and network are
open to inspection. Unless and until such intentional defects are
identified, Tor is arguably a net benefit for freedom.

>> But mostly it helps them to consolidate
>> their power against other states. It's probably been used against Iraq
>> and Russia, for example.
> 
> I wonder what kind of activity you consider here as 'been used against $country'.

I was thinking of allegations that CIA etc agents have orchestrated
dissent in Iraq and Ukraine. If they were there, they probably used Tor,
unless the US government has something better. But I should have said
"...against the governments of Iraq and Russia...".

> As far as I understand, to provide unwatched access to the wider internet
> in firewalled/monitored countries is one of the goals that the US sees
> in the tor project, but I don't exactly consider that 'against $country'.

Yes, I agree. It may harm $country's government, in some sense, but
benefit its people. That's so for the US as well, by the way.

> Andreas
> 
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