Re: [tor-talk] Terminology: Deep v Dark Web

[Mirimir <mirimir@xxxxxxxxxx>]

On 01/25/2014 04:53 AM, Katya Titov wrote:
> Roger Dingledine:
>> On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 06:44:11PM +1000, Katya Titov wrote:
>>> So are there any useful stats on the size of the dark web?
>>
>> Check out http://freehaven.net/anonbib/#oakland2013-trawling
>> for some statistics about the number of hidden services as of about
>> a year ago. It's not all that precise (and the fact that they could
>> collect these stats represents several bugs:
>> https://blog.torproject.org/blog/hidden-services-need-some-love )
>> but it's pretty darn clear that it's not "vast reaches of the
>> Internet" -- more like on the order of 1000 hidden services, many of
>> which aren't all that popular.
>>
>> (Not that popularity is a good judge of the value of a hidden service;
>> see example #1 on https://blog.torproject.org/blog/using-tor-good )
> 
> Thanks Roger, and Moritz too.
> 
> I've put together an article and placed it on the Tor Trac/Wiki:
> 
> https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/HowBigIsTheDarkWeb

I've never liked the term "Dark Web". There's nothing dark about it,
except in the sense that Africa was called the "Dark Continent" because
it was little known in Europe. It was not especially dark there, until
the European invasion.

Virtually all of the "Dark Web" examples are networks that are routed
through the Internet. Most accurately, they are "Virtual Webs". Drawing
on Vernor Vinge, one could call them "High Webs", with the current
Internet being the "Deep Web".[1] If that's too evocative of The Silk
Road et alia, perhaps "Supra Web" would do.

Typical "Dark Web" examples are Tor and its hidden services, I2P and
Freenet. But there are many other private networks (government,
military, academic, enterprise, etc) that are routed via VPNs through
the Internet, and yet are not readily accessible from it. Whatever we
call this category, they belong in it too.

Analogous private networks, generally called anonets, are also routed
via VPNs through the Internet. Most of them use unallocated IP space.
Some of them route those addresses to the Internet, using customized DNS
services. And so they arguably become part of the Internet. This will
all become far easier with IPv6.

There are also physical networks that extend the Internet in various
ways. Some of them arguably become part of the Internet. But many,
including most meshnets, are rather too impromptu for that.

[1] _A Fire Upon the Deep_ (1992) by Vernor Vinge

> It's a start, and I'll keep searching for more relevant information.
> 
> I have no idea how to make it appear on the front page, but then maybe
> it should wait to see whether or not it is up to standards first.
> 
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