Re: SEUL: SEUL duplicating efforts?

[Cyberdyn <cyberdyn@seul.org>]

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On 15-Feb-98 Kevin Forge wrote:
- -> I was trying to make this point.  Any Fail-safe can fail.  And because
- -> of there complexity it's near impossible to make an unbreakable GUI
- -> How are you going to prevent a user from telling his computer that
- -> his old ( pree PnP ) NEC 14" monitor is actually a 21" Monitor of the
- -> same vintage ?  There must be a way out that works weather or not the
- -> GUI thinks it's broken.  This escape must leave him in a position to
- -> easily configure his system.

You seem to be missing mine and Orn's point.  Are my posts getting through here
or what?

We have both told everyone that the initial X setup will be in a mode that
works on about every machine capable of running Linux to begin with.  This
makes it impossible for their X to fail or go into the loop-o-death.

I don't care what monitor you're using it will display standard VGA.  
 Orn pointed out that he had EGA at some point, but if a person is using an EGA
monitor s/he will be quite used to setting it up manually.  I don't think we're
going to find any of our target users using anything below a VGA monitor.  We
can always have a question in the Install that asks if they are using the
inferior monitor types to insure not putting them into a hostile environment
for that monitor.

The majority, if not all, will be at least SVGA.  This means forcing them into
VGA to do setup will insure there isn't any problem.  We can then bump them up
a step at a time with scripts and timeouts that will reset the config to the
previous working config if they try to use settings that don't work.

Windows 95 does the same thing.  The only way it gets a monitor setup correctly
is that 95 drivers are normally shipped with new hardware.  We can place an
option in the menu that says "setup new hardware" since most users are used to
that.  Then take them back to bottom and start again unless there's an exact
match.  Given that they are installing *new* harware at this point it will be
much easier to get *correct* info from them to aid the setup process.

- -> IE.. "type setup at the prompt and get a menu to select what you wish 
- -> to configure ( It will ask you for root password ),  You can then 
- -> select 'X Windows' ( Linux people don't like that name ... but it's 
- -> catchy ).

It's X Window not X Windows.  I catch myself saying the same thing.  Not
because it's catchy, but because Bill had me brainwashed for many years and
there are relics in my brain =)

It's just as easy to get somebody setup in a GUI environment as it is to get
them setup from a console or shell menu.

Dude fires up SEUL for the first time and is left at a shell menu like pdmenu
for the first time.  He's already wondering about Linux at this point.  He
drives on and uses the setup option to get his GUI configured.  He can't get
his hardware setup correctly and is stuck at this shell menu.

He gets ppp up and goes into email.  He's used to using Netscape mail or
Internet mail and isn't at all impressed by this  mail client.  He emails us to
ask for help setting up his display.  I would say we can get it working at this
point after sending mail back and forth for a day or so.  If he remains patient.

Dude fires up SEUL in a GUI/XDM for the first time but can't get a better
display than VGA, he loggs in and gets a nice display with preset menus etc. 
He likes what he sees and can't wait until he can get his display setup to work
in a higher resolution.  He goes into email, some graphical email client
undetermined at this point, he emails us and we work with him on getting it
hooked up.  *BUT* the entire time he is in a GUI which tells him it's just a
matter of getting it configured for his hardware.  If he has this problem to
begin with, he most likely had the same problem in Windows.  Although the
vendors drivers made it easier to configure.  He is still aware that his setup
is *special* and needs to be worked.

If he knows this and is kept in text mode he will be nervous the entire time
that his *special* hardware just won't work under Linux and will be thinking of
just going back to Windows the entire time.

Placed in VGA mode he will not be nervous since he is setup and can do what he
wants to do, he just has to get it configured to use his hardware efficiently
to give him a better display.  But he is still able to use all the software on
his system.



- ---
E-Mail: Cyberdyn@seul.org       Date: 16-Feb-98        Time: 15:16:35
It's a very *____UN*lucky week in which to be took dead.
                -- Churchy La Femme


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