Re: [tor-talk] Tor's reputation problem with pedo, some easy steps the community could take

[Low-Key² <cryptic303@xxxxxxxxx>]

To the uninformed, Tor can conjure up the image of criminals or other scary boogeymen, especially if someone desires to push the discussion in such a direction.  That's why I posted this example of the New Yorker's system.  It's a real world example of a long and well known entity that doesn't exist on the fringe taking full advantage of what is offered by Tor's hidden services. For PR purposes, it's great because it is something they can be shown.  It provides a very good escape from the hypothetical or philosophical games that people play that speculate on both the "evil" and "good" uses of Tor.  Plenty of us have been playing that game for years where we try to mention the good people do with Tor's hidden services.  But, for those who have never even used Tor, it's hard for them to comprehend.  Now there is a very tangible and accessible example they can see.  Thus, it's good PR, especially when someone wants to talk about illegal pornography
 on which there is no true metric.




----- Original Message -----
From: David Vorick <david.vorick@xxxxxxxxx>
To: "tor-talk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx" <tor-talk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: 
Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 1:50 PM
Subject: Re: [tor-talk] Tor's reputation problem with pedo,
 some easy steps the community could take

Except I think that in this case Tor is a bit more like a gun than a screw
driver. The good purposes aren't always obvious and the nefarious purposes
are on the forefront of public attention a lot more. It's not a perfect
analogy but I think you see what I'm getting at.

The purpose of Tor is to liberate people from state control and censorship.
Informally, the purpose of Tor is to help people break rules. We support
Tor because we want oppressive rules to be broken but ultimately it's an
anarchist tool, and that's something that's not going to sit well with the
public.


On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 12:22 PM, Gregory Disney
<gregory.disney@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Tor is research first and
> foremost towards anonymity online via software and hardware development. It
> is a tool like any other a screwdriver could be used to build something or
> be turned into a shiv. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.13
> (GNU/Linux)
> iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJRllkzAAoJEHJ6fv5JwWqhpaYIAKWVGiYQBnmJf4FkqqrW6QMR
> 3TANo3ZKj0M5h7UgIjclOzhI8/Ffn8t5007mNRzac+8Lforj9G5cpyGJKu8kqfv/
> 3FrBzYq5RRzrN6jqAUZCpIDt0j3SZFK1Bhm19+M+pGIVkzArk8HAyUCA+9rNzMXB
> 2L5jBxI0prUWNykJmjkdIWDosFqDJptDsBzKwij+dft/oJiCVJ2s3t2HxNdLrVMw
> h2tTlWsQxQH/OXan+K54Dn/oCL4wxPD+m58xPv9FGLPQEKR6kJsuH+lvxNhLGa+n
> Yxa0fEVZNUqT9K9muOvRDJXgcTxMtJ91B9XG83l5gXPsvg4zFvvSjcJxRJh8s2w= =QGbl
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
>
> On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 12:03 PM, Low-Key² <cryptic303@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > The New Yorker just helped out for some positive PR surrounding hidden
> > services.  Last Monday, they implemented "strongbox."  It's a means of
> > sending the New Yorker tips and information without fear of reprisal,
> since
> > not even the New Yorker can know who someone is as a result of IP address
> > logs. The fundamental tech driving that at the core is Tor's hidden
> > services.
> >
> > Sorry to resurrect an old discussion.  But, this thread came to mind as I
> > was reading about Strongbox this week.  With a main stream publication
> like
> > the New Yorker using Tor's hidden services in order to result in public
> > good, this is a very good piece of PR for Tor that should be emphasized.
> > Here are some links.
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/closeread/2013/05/introducing-strongbox-anonymous-document-sharing-tool.html
> > http://www.newyorker.com/strongbox/
> > http://deaddrop.github.io/
> >
> > http://mashable.com/2013/05/15/new-yorker-strongbox/
> >
> >
> http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2013/05/15/opening-the-lid-on-strongbox-the-new-yorker-anonymous-dropbox-coded-by-aaron-swartz/
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Roger Dingledine <arma@xxxxxxx>
> > To: tor-talk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Cc:
> > Sent: Monday, April 29, 2013 3:06 PM
> > Subject: Re: [tor-talk] Tor's reputation problem with pedo,
> >  some easy steps the community could take
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 29, 2013 at 01:32:59PM -0400, Chris Patti wrote:
> > > As a newcomer to Tor, as I explored the various onions out there, I
> felt
> > as
> > > if practically everywhere I turned there were links taking me to pedo
> > > sites, IRC channels etc.
> >
> > Hi Chris,
> >
> > I agree with you. Part of what we have done a poor job communicating
> > is that hidden services are a tiny fraction of overall Tor use. The
> > wikipedia article on Tor is mostly written by hidden service enthusiasts
> > (as far as I can tell), which further misleads people.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > tor-talk mailing list
> > tor-talk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-talk
> >
> _______________________________________________
> tor-talk mailing list
> tor-talk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-talk
>
_______________________________________________
tor-talk mailing list
tor-talk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-talk 
_______________________________________________
tor-talk mailing list
tor-talk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-talk