Re: [tor-talk] Tor's reputation problem with pedo, some easy steps the community could take

[Gregory Disney <gregory.disney@xxxxxxxxx>]

I think Tor Project does follow Mihkal Bakunin principles on Freedom...
From Revolutionary Catechism:
III. Freedom is the absolute right of every adult man and woman to seek no
other sanction for their acts than their own conscience and their own
reason, being responsible first to themselves and then to the society which
they have *voluntarily *accepted.

IV. It is not true that the freedom of one man is limited by that of other
men. Man is really free to the extent that his freedom, fully acknowledged
and mirrored by the free consent of his fellowmen, finds confirmation and
expansion in their liberty. Man is truly free only among equally free men;
the slavery of even one human being violates humanity and negates the
freedom of all.

V. The *freedom *of each is therefore realizable only in the equality of
all. The realization of freedom through equality, in principle and in fact,
is *justice.*

VI. If there is one fundamental principle of human morality, *it is freedom*.
To respect the freedom of your fellowman *is duty; *to love, help, and
serve him is *virtue.*



On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 4:59 PM, NoName <antispam06@xxxxxxx> wrote:

> On 17.05.2013 19:50, David Vorick wrote:
>
>> Except I think that in this case Tor is a bit more like a gun than a screw
>> driver. The good purposes aren't always obvious and the nefarious purposes
>> are on the forefront of public attention a lot more. It's not a perfect
>> analogy but I think you see what I'm getting at.
>>
>
> It's amusing to see this over and over. And it's only a byproduct of how
> our minds and culture perceive things. It's always about good ol' times and
> about how the new things could sake the foundations of society to the point
> of breaking it. Than it becomes normal and people believe things were
> always like that.
>
> Take the steam engine. It was the devil's work. Mixing fire and water!
> That was against the creation itself. But it turned out to be quite
> practical. The Internet in general isn't any different. Only that banks
> have discovered they can fire half the tellers by launching Internet
> banking. So it was good business. And their short opening hours became
> 24/7. Is Internet bad? No! Of course not! No pedo would have the nerve to
> use the Internet. Why? Because banks and governments do.
>
> Was the steam engine used by the bad guys? Of course. Most of the early
> adopters were probably under the broad classification of bad guys. Because
> serfs weren't even allowed to travel in some countries. And noble men were
> not so eager to spend a lot of money on that. But generic bad guys were
> ready to spend a pretty penny to gain some speed and confort. Guess what!
> Two centuries after, bad guys still use mass transportation. Most of them.
>
> What about the phone? It was hard to get. It was expensive. In a poor
> neighbourhood was cheaper to send some child running. For longer distances
> there was the postal service. And for a quick delivery there was the
> telegraph. And all of them had a good network that could reach places where
> there was no phone line a century later. But creative bad guys saw the
> potential and started using it. For that you now have the so called lawful
> interception. Because most bad guys were using the phone. And they were
> using it more than the student son calling his momma. Mobile phones? So
> large they needed a car to make them portable? The G1. The bad guys had
> those too. And they were using them to coordonate and organise. Gee! The
> same end of the world scenario stupid press announces for Twitter. Only
> those radio phones were easy to intercept. Did the bad guys drop them? Heck
> no! They started using code words.
>
> 3d printers? Well, they can make guns! Big guns! That kill innocent
> people. Have you noticed the dead are always innocent? Even that b****
> Tatcher was an angel. Same went for bittorrent. Now they are using it to
> push the distribution of movies to digital cinemas, to infect your PC with
> paid closed source software. So today not all torrents are criminal. And
> ISPs don't block bt ports anymore. Wait a bit for the 3d printers. When
> Lego would distribute its silly toys by making you pay for the plastic too
> it would be a nice thing abused by some script kiddies.
>
>
>
>  The purpose of Tor is to liberate people from state control and
>> censorship.
>> Informally, the purpose of Tor is to help people break rules. We support
>> Tor because we want oppressive rules to be broken but ultimately it's an
>> anarchist tool, and that's something that's not going to sit well with the
>> public.
>>
>
> Don't be such a child!
>
> State control? How about ISP control? How about corporate control? How
> about abusive partners or parents? In those countries called not–free by
> the corporate media children walk around free. They even have to work and
> be treated as adults from an early age. Even when the village is next to
> the minefield they go working in the morning and return home at night. And
> that's no video game. At the same time, in the free world as the press
> likes to intelectually masturbate children are under house arrest. They are
> under total control. Want to chat with your 4th grade colleague to prepare
> the homework? Want to use that new and wonderful skill of writing? Now get
> adult supervision! Under 13 or 17 or 18 or 21? Your account can be
> terminated. Parents install filtering software and want access to social
> media accounts and passworded diaries. What could seem exagerated for 1984
> is daily life for some kids in the industrialised world.
>
> The purpose of Tor is not to break rules. Is to offer privacy. And guess
> what? Most private people don't break any rules.
>
> Oppresive rules are not broken by Tor. See, Even FBI and DEA are using it.
>
> And anarchism is not about that. Good timing with grafitti can be much
> more valuable.
>
> But it's funny that you use the term public, after all that flag waving.
> Most people I've met use the term public or masses as a way of putting
> themselves above the crowds.
>
> Cheers!
>
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