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Re: Re: [f-cpu] Re: Project short description

On Tue, 4 Sep 2001 whygee@club-internet.fr wrote:

> hallo alle,
> >De: Juergen Goeritz <goeritz@oekomm.de>
> >On Tue, 4 Sep 2001, Michael Riepe wrote:
> >> On Tue, Sep 04, 2001 at 09:22:36AM +0200, Juergen Goeritz wrote:
> >> [...]
> >> > > If you make a SoC that includes an F-CPU core, the source code for the
> >> > > entire chip must be released under the terms of the GPL because it's a
> >> > > derived work.  If you can live with that restriction...
> >> > No, I can't. I was wondering if it could be changed to the
> >> > more open LGPL license style like with LEON. Is this possible?
> >> We had that discussion (again!) some weeks ago...
> >> For the moment, my answer is "no".
> >That's a pity because I also don't want to open my design
> >without any return involved. How to solve this situation?
> there is no "solution". Would you ask Micro$oft to change their
> distribution licence ? :-P

Why not? To ask doesn't cost a thing (but my own nerves).
And for me they could be willing to make an exception :-)

> There is a probability that the F-CPU licence will change
> if we get advices from legal experts : GPL has a few drawbacks
> but it's the only working licence that we know. Later, a F-CPU
> licence will cover the dark corners of RTL source code (all the
> problems with the meanings of "compilation" and "linking" that
> is different in our case), but i don't believe that our basic
> idea and understanding of "freedom" will change.

But you also want to keep control. Ain't that a contradiction?

> >> > On the other hand, if it's not possible to change to LGPL,
> >> > I would not want to invest my own money but only go for it
> >> > when there is enough funding money and goods. Up to now my
> >> > opinion was that you can't really live from open projects.
> >> > But you are invited to proove the opposite...
> >> We have to prove nothing, since we never claimed to be able to make
> >> money with the F-CPU.  On the other hand, switching to LGPL won't make
> >> us rich and famous, either.  I agree that commercial F-CPU users might
> >> benefit from LGPL, but my primary goal never was to enable companies to
> >> make lots of money, without having to return *anything*.
> >Hmh! Why not found an AG and you become shareholders until
> >the proof of concept is done and the first chip released?
> >This way we could start with only about 100K DM.
> how much chocolate could i buy with 100K DM ?

Depends on the chocolate - I vote for cool Toblerone ;-)

How much do you earn a year? Whether this is enough only 
depends on your usual way to spend the money...

I just proposed to setup an environment where industry could
relate to and go for contracts and license. Because either one
wants to stay in control of something, then one has to take the
responsibility, or one doesn't and is free of it. Even LEON is
maintained by a company - Gaisler Research.

> >> Interested in the mCluster project, or in F-CPU development?
> >Interested in a new architecture that must be extendable
> >and free the developer from that creapy kernel/driver and
> >whatsoever low level adaption stuff and provide software
> >portability. I do not focus on a processor alone...
> We do not "only" focus on the CPU : For example i am both
> a programer and electronician (rather loosy both) and i have
> remarked that the CPU is the center of both worlds. This is
> why my efforts are in this direction.
> Concerning your reasons (I/O, programming model etc.), assume
> that the CPU is the center of the computer. If the CPU is not
> free the rest will remain crappy. OTOH, putting a "free" CPU
> in the middle of a "non-free" HW won't solve everything
> magically.

No, in my opinion the cpu is not the center of the hardware
because if you have multi cpu on chip which one should be
the center? I see a cpu just as an information modification

Look at Richard, he thinks the display is the center of all.
He is misleaded too. He just sees it from his application.

The center may be the communication but from where to where?
Look at cpu vs. memory. There is communication taking place
(address vs. data). Look at two cpus - the same. 

Me think the center is the exchange of information!

> Ok, i will let others answer (i've seen nicO's answer
> and i fear a flame war...).

No, why make a flame war. But it's very interesting to read
your opinions and fears.


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