Re: [tor-talk] Non-free country law preventing Tor from getting donations

[Joe Btfsplk <joebtfsplk@xxxxxxx>]

On 6/15/2014 2:52 PM, grarpamp wrote:
> The code is open for inspection so it's not an overt issue, and the
> cash funds a lot of good research.
I'm not accusing Tor Project of anything underhanded.  And you are 
correct (it funds a lot of research).
I'm saying, to the public & many potential users, perception is reality, 
and you're judged by the company you keep.

In general, those human behaviors / concepts are inescapable.

In regards to the code being open for inspection, apparently that 
doesn't mean a whole lot.

Though most of the "hidden" backdoors, etc., associated w/ gov't action 
have been proprietary, there have been a few cases where "strange" 
things in open source code were hidden well enough, that no one 
discovered them for a long time.  If I'm wrong, I stand corrected.

Seriously, how many people that don't work on Tor / TBB code every day, 
could just "look" at the code & understand every single thing it does, 
down to the tiniest detail?
Or how many people actually have the time to examine every single line 
of code, that also have the expertise to understand everything, to the 
smallest detail?  Not many.

If that's not significant, the NSA has spent billions (w/ a 'B') - to 
encourage companies & countries to do what they want.
They also developed skills & a network, that most people thought 
unimaginable.  Like science fiction.  That's now a fact.  When I 
mentioned that potential capability a few yrs ago, that idea was shot 
down by Mr. Perry.  In his defense, he was in good company - most people 
couldn't imagine they could ever do the things that actually became true.

That said, if NSA & who knows who else, will pay tens or hundreds of 
millions to companies & countries to get what they want, they 
*certainly* would spend whatever it took to set up enough of their own 
relays to capture a significant % of Tor traffic. Still think that's 
impossible?  Read ALL of the released Snowden document.   I heard 
Snowden say in recent interview, there are more documents coming - 
probably this Summer - that are just as mind blowing, or more, than any 
so far.

OK - but what about Tor's encryption?  Well, it may be uncrackable 
today, but what about in a month?  The NSA & many other gov'ts have 
literally the best computer minds in the world, working around the clock 
on breaking encryption. No, a lot of others (much more informed than me) 
don't think the gov't is going to sit around & do nothing, while 
terrorists or other heinous criminals use encrypted communication.

And some (naive) people may not know this, but gov'ts *don't announce* 
when they develop technology that revolutionizes spying or catching 
terrorists, etc.  It would be shooting themselves in the foot.  The 
Snowden papers were almost a once in several lifetimes event.  And if we 
think the NSA (or any gov't agency in the world) will stop illegal 
activities, just because some papers were released, we probably also 
believe in Santa Clause.  Heads of the NSA were caught straight up, 
telling bald-faced lies under oath to Congress, but all are still 
employed.  Happy as pigs in the mud.  If I had done that, I'd be *under* 
the jail right now.

Yes, I believe the NSA & other agencies have a job to do.  The question, 
how far do they actually have to go?
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