Re: court trial against me -

[mark485anderson@xxxxxx]

works the same way in the USA. if you have money to hire good lawyers
you get justice. if you do not, your SOL (shit out of luck). And most of
these non-profit agencies are of little help.
the people in my town, most are so f**king brain dead that they just go
along with whatever crap is piled up on them. USA is NOT the Free
country many think it is. Truth is you are mostly on your own in such
situations and yes, that is the reason they think so little of
persecuting you. i thought people in the courts in germany were smarter
than the people mirko is talking about.

On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 20:58:52 +0000, "Robert Hogan"
<robert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> said:
> On Wednesday 14 November 2007 20:22:09 TOR Admin (gpfTOR1) wrote:
> > Hi Mirko,
> >
> > 1: by German law a Tor node admin is something like an access provider.
> > You are not responsible for your traffic. If the court have only an IP
> > address and you have a tor status log, they have nothing.
> >
> > 2: Tor is a legal service in Germany (today and yesterday, tomorrow we
> > will see). If you provided only a legal service, it is no way to
> > construct a case of aiding and abetting and you are not a disquieter or
> > something like that.
> >
> > 3: May be, there is a judge, who do not these facts. The law depends not
> > only on one judge. Dont give up.
> >
> > 4: You need help. Try to contact the following organizations:
> >
> >   - AK Vorratsdatenspeicherung (data retention free contact form ;-) at
> >     http://www.vorratsdatenspeicherung.de/content/view/70/82/lang,de/ )
> >
> >   - German Privacy Foundation e.V i.Gr. (data rentention free contact
> >     form at http://www.privacyfoundation.de/index.php?id=36 )
> >
> >   - Humanistische Union e.V. (They have lawyers by training and they are
> >     interested in TOR.)
> >
> >   - Chaos Computer Club,
> >   - Heise Verlag, try to contact the journalist H. Bleich
> >
> > By the way (for other admins), it is not a good solution, to ignore the
> > first letter. Go to the "visit" and explain, what you have done and what
> > you have not done.
> >
> 
> This is all excellent advice, and it is characteristic of the level of 
> solidarity and helpfulness regularly displayed by Tor operators on this
> list.
> 
> But it underlines the fact that a Tor operator in need is always:
> 
> 1. In need of concrete, immediate help. Guaranteed. 
> 2. Completely on their own. 
> 
> The second point can't be emphasized enough. Nothing we say on this list
> can 
> help with the legal bills or demonstrate physical solidarity in court.
> Mirko 
> is a tor server operator. There are hundreds of us. But that judge and 
> prosecutor looked around the court and thought to themselves, 'If this
> Tor is 
> so legit, where's your backup Mirko?'
> 
> The fact that Mirko waited until the case was done and dusted before
> reporting 
> in shows us all the problem we have. We *expect* to be cut loose.
> 
> We are a single-issue, special interest group. Mirko shouldn't have to go 
> begging to a bunch of tangentially-interested organizations looking for a 
> sympathetic ear. He should be able to come to us and we, as a group,
> should 
> be able to cover some of his legal costs and access to a specialist
> lawyer. 
> We should have had representation in that court blasting the prosecutor
> back 
> to conveyancing cases. Simple as that. Unless we can do that as a body,
> we 
> are all fucked as individuals. Period.
> 
> If you want to know my suggestion for remedying this situation:
> 
> http://archives.seul.org/or/talk/Nov-2007/msg00144.html
> 
> I would give time and money to such an organization. So let's get some
> sound 
> advice from each other and set one up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
-- 
  
  mark485anderson@xxxxxx

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