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Re: [school-discuss] math/science Linux desktop - The Achilles Heel



Since there is so much available in open source now, I guess I see two aspects of training here that we should address: 1) Training in common packages set up on all school computers. This would include Firefox, Moodle, TeacherTool, OpenOffice, (and someday hopefully OpenAdmin) and for these critical apps, the district should provide the training. And Jim's right, at Brandon we focussed on the early adopters and they carried the torch from there to the rest of the teachers.

But this thread got started when I was asking about custom applications like math and science for high school teachers, something only selected teachers would need, and Les properly pointed out that training for these custom apps will probably not be systemized, so that's when I started thinking about what we *could* systemize to meet the training needs of these teachers might be to teach them how to install and learn a new Open Source package. That training would apply to many more teachers, assuming we give them a sandbox to play in (a classroom server that they can load applications themselves). In the high school realm, I think it is much more important to give certain teachers their own sandbox to play in, even if they have enterprise thin clients in the class for the more basic applications. Otherwise, we're robbing them of the whole Open Source experience, and I just don't think we can count on the IT department to explore new applications that might be of interest to teachers as frequently as teachers would if we show them how to do it. Plus, some of these teachers (computer science teachers, e.g.) can then develop the skills to download the source code and add features they want, closing the loop on the OSS experience.

Good dialog, I'm already getting ideas as to how to help the high school principal with whom we're working. For example, why not let teachers unplug their district-provided thin clients from the class data port and plug them into their classroom server when they want to run their own custom apps? You'd need the clients to be registered on the district servers so that if the teacher 'broke' their classroom server trying to install new OSS, they could replug them into the district servers. I assume there would not be any security issues with this, since you'd reboot the clients every time you swapped their network connection.

And anyway, William and I hate to do the same thing more than twice...

Best to all,
Daniel

James P. Kinney III wrote:
Hi all,

I've been swamped and unable to reply until now.

The teacher training aspect is vital to the process of adding anything
"new" at the classroom level. To this end, Atlanta Public Schools is
addressing this need for training of teachers for the new Linux thin
clients in place and for more to be placed over the next 1-3 years. It
looks like APS will be converting to an Open Source system for the
students!!!

So part of the plan they are getting bids on right now includes basic
training in things like Moodle, TeacherTool and OpenOffice. They finally
"got it" and recognized that the early adopters and tech savvy teachers
should get the training first so as to act a "lightning rods" in each
school. This is directly related to the Brandon work and the analysis of
the outcome and process. APS really did their homework on this aspect.
As for specific application usage in classrooms I see the OpenSource
world as being the ONLY place that can actually respond to teacher
needs. The other stuff responds to "market" needs (<cynicism> i.e. the
marketing director talks to the bean counters and they add fluff and
cost </cynicism>).

For example: TuxMath is a really cool game. The kids like it because
it's a game. (it's a real system hog in a thin client environment BTW)
It has a new development team now and they are adding really fantastic
features that keep logs of right and wrong answers, offer game play
based on specific learning needs such as working addition with the
numbers 11-19 or subtraction with positive and negative numbers, and a
report generating feature that can be used to give a GRADE (!!) based on
a fun activity that really is a test.

When it is finished..... (can't wait! I've demo'ed the test code to a
few teachers and watched their eyes pop out)

So to respond directly to Daniel's "open source trainers for schools",
um, yeah, we need to talk as we have assembled just that team to address
exactly that need and they are working to respond to the scope of the
need.
As was discussed at NECC, once the schools stop having to pour million$
into software licenses every year, they can divert their license budget
to supporting that front line - teachers.

On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 15:39 -0400, Daniel Howard wrote:
Yeah, William and I were discussing that over lunch after our meeting. We mused that it will be great when enough big districts like Atlanta Public Schools have Linux deployed everywhere and tell the book publishers that they want Linux versions of textbook support software...

In the meantime, I think my eParent model will have to suffice: William and I provided much of the initial training of our teachers at Brandon, and then I formed a new PTA committee called the eParents so we could get parents to help out in learning new software and showing teachers how to use it. I'll try to assemble a cadre of technology-savvy parents from this high school, burn some live CDs they can use at home, and have each of them help. But I have to say these teachers today looked really motivated to learn this stuff.

You know Les, that's a really good point: there's probably a growing market now for software trainers that specialize in Open Source educational packages. Since Open Source schools are no longer spending that money on licenses, maybe now they can actually afford to hire a trainer to come in...

Daniel

Les Richardson wrote:
Hi Daniel,

The larger problem with any of this software use is the training aspect, and the teaching materials (if any).

If they are being used in a teaching context, then a teacher will want materials for assignments, etc. Having software without that will mean a much slower adoption rate.

Thus software is in a symbiotic relationship with support materials and documentation, teaching materials, etc.

That is another 'issue' that should be considered in any Linux based solution...

Les Richardson
Open Admin for Schools



On Mon, 10 Sep 2007, Daniel Howard wrote:

Well, William and I met with the High School principal and his assistant principal this morning, and also met several teachers (math, physics, music, multimedia) and all of them are tremendously excited about getting working Linux computers in their classrooms, and the potential for lots of new Open Source software titles. The teachers have already heard how successful the other Atlanta schools were, and don't seem to care a whit that it will not be Windows based. They just want working computers, and lots of 'em, and they've heard this is good stuff.

We've asked them to send us ideas for what they'd like to use the computers for in their classrooms, but at the same time, William and I are guessing they have no idea what they could ask for, so we thought we'd put together a system for them to play with with a bunch of high school appropriate titles on it (like the math titles I listed below). Can anyone suggest other high school appropriate applications for math, science, yearbook publishing, web page development (actually I think William has that one covered), control of MIDI keyboards and music composition, audio mixing (they have a small studio), etc.

Thanks in advance,
Daniel


Daniel Howard wrote:
I'm meeting monday with an Atlanta High School principal that wants to use Open Source applications in his school. He's familiar with the K12LTSP program that Atlanta Public Schools rolled out to 7 schools last year (he was formerly the principal of a middle school that was in the pilot) and APS apparently has 35 more elementary and middle schools lined up for it. So he's a big fan of OSS now. But high schools are different creatures, and there are lots of reasons why selected classes (like math and science) need stand alone desktops for CPU intensive processing.

I'm wondering if there is a Linux package that is geared towards math/science like K12LTSP is to general education. Something that installs with FreeMat, Octave, SciLab, etc. built into it. Anyone seen anything like that?

Daniel


--
Daniel Howard
President and CEO
Georgia Open Source Education Foundation


--
Daniel Howard
President and CEO
Georgia Open Source Education Foundation



--
Daniel Howard
President and CEO
Georgia Open Source Education Foundation