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Re: SEUL: Distrib: Some thoughts

On Jun 2, Greg Bell wrote
regarding "Re: SEUL: Distrib: Some thoughts": 
> Gabriel Krabbe wrote:
> > definitely not. it would, however, be desirable to grab one of the many
> > so-called "magic filters" and add a pretty interface to the setup of
> > that. this would leave the user with the command "lpr <document>" w/o
> > the need to know about different file formats, filters etc.
> So if I take you statements correctly you should just tell a new user
> "sorry linux has the wonderful printers system already setup 


> and it's just too bad that your printer costs less then $1000 dollars 
> cause that's the only kind of printer linux understands but you can 
> search the net to find a filter for your printer???

if we agree that postscript is the way to go - and if we don't, i wash
my hands in innocence, as there is naught out there that makes as much 
as half the sense of (e)ps - we rely on ghostscript, which presently
supports all printers i can think of as in home use and then some.
all hp models (yep, sometimes not all subversions, but i guess that, for
example (a bad one) a laserjet 4 won't mind being fed data meant for a 
laserjet 3), laser as well as ink, nec, canon, you name it.

> Unless I am totally mistaken the whole reason for this lists existance
> is to develop an easy way for a new user to get/install/use linux, this
> kinda defeats the purpose does it not????

it would were you right in your printer assumption, but you're not,
so it isn't. 
this list is, indeed, intended to make it easy for a new user to
_install_ and to _maintain_ linux (much easier than buying it in a
bookstore won't happen, most people's net connection won't stand a
300meg distribution d/l). our job is to: a) pull together those tools
necessary, b) add on those tools we think useful, c) add pointers to
everything else (an lsm browser or somesuch) to cater to the needs of
those we didn't expect existed, d) add pretty, easy to use interfaces
to the user.
of all those, d) will and does require quite a lot of work, a) and b)
are present on practically any current distribution, c) requires some
marketing wrt convincing developers to 1) _add_ their creations to the
lsm and 2) specify the configuration needed for their product to work
as expected/promised, so that someone (the developer, one of those on
this list or some other helpful soul) can pull together the necessary
scripts/files/whatever to whatever installation/maintaining interface
"standard" we create.

> > don't reinvent the wheel and write new daemons when all you need to do is
> > stick to standard unix-philosophy and combine a number of tools, adding
> > a pretty interface to configure them.
> maybe, just maybe this is one reason that linux/unix is so difficult to 
> begin with.  The reliance on the tools that were created who knows how
> long ago.  
> Just off the top of my head take ppp connections what should be a simple
> thing is, bacause of it's reliance on "tools" probably one of the most 
> difficult things under linux. 

at present it is, and that's the mission: build a pretty frontend that
a) sorts out what you have installed and what you lack, helping with
   necessary upgrades
b) puts together the config files/scripts, requesting info from the user
   as needed (username, password, number to call; possibly modem type -
   i have yet to experience a modem that  doesn't work with pppd)
c) provide an interface to start and stop ppp (text mode: "ppp start" and
   "ppp stop" or something similar, x mode: point-and-ppp)
> I am not saying reinvent the wheel, just reinflate it so that it is more
> usable

prehaps a better way of saying that is: don't build a new car, use the
powerful monster we have and give it leather seats and a padded steering
wheel. whatever. i'm no poet, i'm a pragmatist, if that's the correct 
english word.

I tried to daydream, but my mind kept wandering.

email will be posted as i see fit.

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