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Re: 20090101

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Mike Perry wrote:
> Thus spake Smuggler (smuggler@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx):
>> Olaf Selke wrote:
>>> Eugen Leitl wrote:
>>>> On Sat, Nov 10, 2007 at 08:14:34PM +0100, Olaf Selke wrote:
>>>>> nothing will change for German tor operators due to this law. It defines
>>>>> how to store and how to hand over stored data to the authorities. Data
>>>>> not collected at all can't be stored, right?. But this law does not
>>>>> enforce tor operators to collect any data.
>>>> Oh, really? So ISPs, VoIP and mobile phone providers have nothing to fear,
>>>> right?
>>> right!
>> Wrong. I read the law. My lawyers read the law. It doesnt say: Store the
>> data you have. It says: Store these specific datasets, no matter if you
>> have them or not. The comments in the "Regierungsentwurf" are very telling.
>> So, I am sorry. Tor nodes will have to log. ISPs will have to log.
>> Everyone doing public telco services will have to log.
> Actually, out of curiosity do your lawyers believe that
> upstream/backbone/IX ISPs will also be required to log (and to log the
> same type of data)? That would seem to be a lot of data.. Not to
> mention that upstream ISPs will not have customer information for IP
> addresses. It would seem to me that Tor nodes are much more similar to
> backbone routers than consumer ISPs.

No, upstreams/backbones etc dont have to log.
Only parties generating traffic data in the first place (dialup) and
parties changing traffic data (Tor) have to store.
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