Re: [pygame] New pygame.org website

hi,

The download page can be updated with the same admin interface that someone managed to post news with. There's currently 6 users able to edit it... so I guess one of those did it. I added Paul and yourself now as well. See this issue on 'the website needs updates': https://bitbucket.org/pygame/pygame/issues/204/ Updating news, and community management is definitely a role which is useful, and needs to be shared amongst a few people. I'll track the 'make document of admin people' work in that issue.

The open issue on the topic of dynamically generating the downloads page: https://bitbucket.org/pygame/pygame/issues/152 This needs a jinja2 template, and a script which iterates over the 'downloads' repo. I'd suggest basing the html on the existing html. Whilst there are better layout options, that would be pretty easy to do for now, and is familiar for existing pygame downloads page users. There are more details to consider of course (like making an actual downloads repo and moving existing files in... and meta data for the files).

There's been a couple of efforts to move the wiki into version control. There's even a wiki in the bitbucket version control, and scripts to convert the html into markup formats that bitbucket supports. (there's an issue open on this topic). However, in practice, waaaaay less people updated it without a gui (Yes, even markdown and rst is a turn off for quick edits). Pointing them to the bitbucket interface also meant very few edits. I think it was 5-10x less edits. Furthermore even requiring a login means 5-10x less edits (100x if you include the deluge of spam). When those numbers are multiplied together... it meant a tiny amount of wiki edits were happening. Then the bitbucket wiki started getting spammed to hell, but we didn't have tools to moderate it. Along with the edits dropping close to zero, I moved things back to the website wiki. But now there are pretty good web gui tools for markdown. Here's the issue on the wiki topic... but it needs a lot more thought on the topics of spam and ease of use. https://bitbucket.org/pygame/pygame/issues/153/wiki-website-generation-from-wiki-repo

Burn out for the website admins, and website defacement because of spam means that a workable solution for spam prevention needs to be in place first for any wiki replacement.

Keeping the existing game data for me, and a lot of project authors is very important. For me the main purpose of the website should be to help people making games have a community of makers. Showing your work is often one of the only rewards for making these projects in the first place. Seeing people upload their game to a website for the first time, I always see a grin on their face.

On Mon, Dec 26, 2016 at 12:48 PM, Thomas Kluyver <takowl@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On 25 December 2016 at 03:30, René Dudfield <renesd@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I've been non contactable for a few weeks due to personal issues. Which I guess was frustrating to Thomas, which has led to this latest effort to make a new website.

I'm glad to see you back; I was a bit worried that something had happened to you. I hope things are OK.

Truth be told, the website has been frustrating me for quite a long time, but your absence really highlighted the need for something that doesn't depend on a single person maintaining it, and I have seen on the mailing list that there's a lot of talent and enthusiasm that could be harnessed if the website was a more collaborative project.
most parts of the website can be updated (by wiki, bitbucket, stackoverflow, etc)
This is a good point, and I should update the 'Getting Started' page on the wiki. I cannot, however, see a way to update the all-important Download page.
we need to document who has access to which admin things (there are a few people who have access to everything, but I guess not everyone knows each other, and some people go inactive some times)
+1. For instance, you mentioned that users jmm0 and TheSheep also have admin access to Disqus, but those usernames don't obviously relate to anyone I remember on the mailing list or on Bitbucket, so I'm not sure who they are or how to contact them.
moderation, respect and spam are issues we need to work on.
+1. I hope you don't feel that our efforts to build a replacement site in your absence were disrespectful :-)
Looking forward to moving forward on the new website!
How would you like to see the transition happen? Now that you're back we can presumably make some updates to the current site, which reduces the pressure to replace it. I'd still like to see things like the download page generated from files in version control, so that people can update them through pull requests. My inclination is to move the wiki content into version control as well.

For the game feed and the login system, how important do you think it is to maintain the data from the old site? We could try to build a Python web application around the same database, and then switch over to it. That would be significantly more work than making a new system from scratch, but it means a smoother transition, and preserves the existing archive. Do you want to keep using the current server for dynamic parts of a new site, or move pygame away from it?

Thanks,
Thomas